DNG compatibility

You think dng is the stable, universal, archival RAW format it’s cracked up to be? Try this experiment. Most of us have multiple raw processing programs on our desktops. See which ones will recognize and open a dng file.

Capture one? Nope. DoX? Nope. Silkypix? Yep. Lightroom? Yep. RawShooter? Yep. But none of the adjustments you make to a dng file in these programs can be read in any other program.

One would think that Adobe Raw Converter (it's their format) would be everyone’s lowest common denominator, but that’s not so. There are two operations in dng file management, the initial conversion from RAW to DNG, which is what the programs display, and subsequent changes you make to that file. Only Bridge can read the changes you make, using ACR, in a dng file after the fact. Even Iview MediaPro won't recognize edits to dng files.

It appears that you need to commit to a single workflow, and never stray. Imagine if you could only print images shot on Fuji film on Fuji paper and no other. That is something of the situation we find ourselves in. Monogamy may be a good idea in life, but it’s annoying in a workflow.

Comments

[JeffH]

Doug,

That is a very interesting observation. DNG attempts to solve one very large issue of future accessibility to the RAW file data, but it does nothing to preserve the cross platform accessibility of the adjustments made by the photographer. I'd say that this is just as big an issue as the original one. The amount of time spent 'processing' RAW files is significant and in many cases would be very difficult replicate at a later date from scratch in another application. This might be a very good issue to pose to openraw.org as well as Adobe, to see if either of them have considered this issue. At present, Lightroom in it’s Beta form, and Adobe’s Camera RAW will not open and display the adjustments stored in each others side car files. (I understand that they will once Lightroom is released.) So I have already had the frustration of not being able to work interchangeably between two different RAW processing applications that I use on a daily basis. This is one of the reasons I have hesitated to try out Lightzone, because all of the work I do in that application most likely will not transfer over to Camera Raw, Lightroom, or Photoshop.

Jeff Henderson

[Doug Pardee]

It should be noted that RawShooter will not open DNGs from cameras that it doesn't recognize. This prevents RawShooter from continuing to be used for future cameras.

I have read that the same is true for Apple Aperture.

Oh, and you can add: Bibble? Nope. And just about every converter provided by a camera manufacturer: Nikon Capture? Nope. Canon Digital Photo Professional? Nope. And so on.

In my opinion, at the current moment a commitment to DNG is a commitment to use Adobe software for Raw conversion. This is not an inherent problem with the DNG format which actually looks pretty good to me, but just the reality of today's competitive commercial world.

[Joe Reifer]

Hi Doug,

If you setup iView Media pro to show your embedded DNG previews, your adjustments will show up. This feature is actually one of the best things about using an iView + DNG workflow - both the thumbnail and media views reflect the changes you made in your RAW converter. Sounds like a small feature, but it's a huge benefit to be able to see thumbnails and previews with accurate exposure and color adjustments.

Another great benefit of using the iView + DNG workflow is batch conversion of DNGs to JPEGs is about 10 times faster than using the Image Processor in Photoshop. A huge timesaver when submitting proofs to clients, or preparing images for the copyright office.

And yes, it would be nice if eveyone standardized and programs were able to read each others RAW adjustments, but I wouldn't hold my breath. The large embedded preview inside the DNG is extremely useful though.

The DAM Book forums are a great place to learn more about DNGs. www.thedambook.com

Cheers,

Joe

[Doug Plummer]

I posted this issue in the Dam Book forums a while back, and was not able to get a satisfactory answer. I have not been successful in getting my changes to dng files to reflect in Iview. I have all the proper boxes checked, and I rebuild the files, but nada. I wish I knew what the secret ingredient was. It's a feature I really want.

[Joe Reifer]

Hi Doug,

Send me an email and I'll try to help with your DNG / iView settings.

Cheers,

Joe

[Joe Reifer]

Hi Doug,

I've written a blog post about how to get iView to show a correct DNG preview image here:
http://www.joereifer.com/words/?p=81

Cheers,

Joe

[Peter Krogh]

Doug,
Did you get this sorted out? There's several pieces of misinformation here (iView can't see DNG adjustments, ACR and Lightroom don't share pipelines).

It is true that Parametric Image Editors generally don't see each other's instructions, but that's the nature of the beast that has nothing to do with DNG. DNG actually helps to solve problems that are created by the use of Parametric Image Editors.

It would be good to correct any out of date or incorrect information.

Peter

[Doug Plummer]

Peter,

Thanks for posting, you're certainly the expert in this realm. I got a note from Richard Anderson yesterday on how to fix this, which is to keep the Auto-Update option on in the folder view.

Mt criticism of dng is more about the hype than anything else. DNG in the popular imagination is being portrayed as some kind of universal format. It's not.

[chris]

You are correct DNG's are not perfect but we have got them to work fine here and we routinely process hundreds of photos a day.
One thing that helped was to make sure the Camera Raw settings in Bridge reembedded the preview image after changes where made. At first we didn't do this and where wondering why other programs did not show our "retouched" image. When we did the preview embedded our changes in bridge show up and programs like Portfolio show the modified preview which is great.